Fringy, science-stuff, maybe fact or fiction?

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User: NeutronNorman
Name: Norman Anthony Aguero
Currently a student at FIU. My major is chemistry and my minor is physics. My goal is to hopefully earn a Ph.D. in physical organic chemistry.

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Sunday, 26 November 2006

Well, form MSNBC:

NEW YORK - A British philosophy professor who has been a leading champion of atheism for more than a half-century has changed his mind. He now believes in God — more or less — based on scientific evidence, and he says so on a video released Thursday.

At age 81, after decades of insisting that belief is a mistake, the professor, Antony Flew, has concluded that some sort of intelligence or first cause must have created the universe. A super-intelligence is the only good explanation for the origin of life and the complexity of nature, Flew said in a telephone interview from England.

Flew said he was best labeled a deist, like Thomas Jefferson, whose God was not actively involved in people’s lives.

“I’m thinking of a God very different from the God of the Christian and far and away from the God of Islam, because both are depicted as omnipotent Oriental despots, cosmic Saddam Husseins,” he said. “It could be a person in the sense of a being that has intelligence and a purpose, I suppose.”

 

A gradual conversion


Flew first made his mark with the 1950 article “Theology and Falsification,” based on a paper for the Socratic Club, a weekly Oxford religious forum led by the writer and Christian thinker C.S. Lewis.

Over the years, Flew proclaimed the lack of evidence for God while teaching at Oxford, Aberdeen, Keele and Reading universities in Britain, in visits to numerous U.S. and Canadian campuses and in books, articles, lectures and debates.

There was no one moment of change but a gradual conclusion over recent months for Flew, a spry man who still does not believe in an afterlife.

Yet biologists’ investigation of DNA “has shown, by the almost unbelievable complexity of the arrangements which are needed to produce [life], that intelligence must have been involved,” Flew says in the new video, “Has Science Discovered God?”

The video draws from a discussion last May in New York organized by author Roy Abraham Varghese’s Institute for Metascientific Research in Garland, Texas. Participants were Flew; Varghese; Israeli physicist Gerald Schroeder, an Orthodox Jew; and Roman Catholic philosopher John Haldane of the University of St. Andrews in Scotland.

 

‘Follow the evidence, wherever it leads’


The first hint of Flew’s turn was a letter in the August-September issue of Britain’s Philosophy Now magazine. “It has become inordinately difficult even to begin to think about constructing a naturalistic theory of the evolution of that first reproducing organism,” he wrote.

The letter commended arguments in Schroeder’s “The Hidden Face of God” and “The Wonder of the World” by Varghese, an Eastern Rite Catholic layman.

This week, Flew finished writing the first formal account of his new outlook for the introduction to a new edition of his “God and Philosophy,” scheduled for release next year by Prometheus Books.

Prometheus specializes in skeptical thought, but if his belief upsets people, well, “that’s too bad,” Flew said. “My whole life has been guided by the principle of Plato’s Socrates: Follow the evidence, wherever it leads.”

 

Discussion among the unfaithful


Last week, Richard Carrier, a writer and Columbia University graduate student, posted new material based on correspondence with Flew on the atheistic Web page Infidels.org. Carrier reassured atheists that Flew accepted only a “minimal God” and believed in no afterlife.

Flew’s “name and stature are big. Whenever you hear people talk about atheists, Flew always comes up,” Carrier said. Still, when it comes to Flew’s reversal, “apart from curiosity, I don’t think it’s like a big deal.”

Flew told The Associated Press that his current ideas had some similarity with those of U.S. “intelligent design” theorists, who see evidence for a guiding force in the construction of the universe. He accepts Darwinian evolution but doubts that it can explain the ultimate origins of life.

Flew, the son of a Methodist minister, became an atheist at 15.

Early in his career, he argued that no conceivable events could constitute proof against God for believers, so skeptics were right to wonder whether the concept of God meant anything at all.

Another landmark was his 1984 article “The Presumption of Atheism,” playing off the presumption of innocence in criminal law. Flew said the debate over God must begin by presuming atheism, putting the burden of proof on those arguing that God existed.

 

Well, the universe most certainly had a beginning. What the f#$k caused it?  What was there before time ever existed? How can mathematicians consider a referance point, where negative infinity eventuated? There apparently is no such time. There was a beginning. What caused the event we refer to as the "Big Bang?"
Why didn't it happen 20 billion years ago, instead of fifty billion? Let alone yesterday?
How long before time ever was initiated, that the potential of a 4 space universe existed, and why did it happen at a certain event?
Well, from that initial point of view, atheism becomes quite like some form of a belief in deity. They believe in no god, no initial cause or event, their minds boggle with a creation. Just like mine does. Atheism is based on a lack of evidence. Just as belief in deity is based in a lack of concrete facts. So, atheistists, you own your own religion; a doctrine based on faith. Your faith is based on your chosen philosophical doctrines, just as believers base theirs on others. Matthew vs. Einstein. Newton vs. Nietsche.
Well, I do not support organized religions, but I tend to see that religious denominations are the first ones giving aid when natural calamities occur. Storms, tsusamies, earthquakes, etc. I've never heard of an atheistic group shelving out donations or monies to help the victims of such disasters.
Yet they tend to 'knock down' religions as money making schemes for a few, or mind control.  They blame all of humanities sorrows on differances of ideological viewpoints.
Let me see an atheist that can live the life of a monk, or a nun, even as the local pastor of a fundamental, rural Christian church and organize contributions to give to the less-fortunates. Some atheists would probably pocket donations just like some fringy tele-evangelists would, as well as some 'established' religious denominations.
Maybe atheists are too self centered, gratifing their aminalistic tendencies, without any form of restraint, and trying to bury guilt, thus embracing the lack of a 'god' to justify their selfish actions. Maybe they are just plain angry, like a child that does not receive the attention, better, a gift asked for but not received on a  Christmas morning. Blame god, blame the parents, blame others for the lack of self centered  gratifications not immediately received. 
Maybe believers are also too self centered , and feel liable about their natural impulses. Maybe deists are trying to find restraint for the guilt they feel, divorcing themselves from the innate appetites inherent in our genetic programming for survival. Maybe they are also angry, because of cultural taboos against them  following or fulfilling their basic desires. Blame Satan, blame their demons, blame others for their ineptness to cope with their lack of self centered gratifications never received.

Posted by: NeutronNorman at 18:45 | link | comments (3)


Comments:
#1  26 November 2006 - 20:17
 
interesting article.

you know me, a quasi atheist, spiritualist, occultist, worshipper of all goodness, mother nature, etc..
yesterday i stopped at a catholic church and i began to pray. St. Anthony is my saint. on a saturday, when the church was empty that's when i felt welcomed.

is it possible that this guy is feeling mortal and is scared out of his mind about death???? heaven, hell, the whole shaboom?

hugs,
faaraa
Contact me View user's mediablog faaraa
#2  27 November 2006 - 07:17
 
My middle name is Anthony, named after the Catholic saint.
Contact me View user's mediablog NeutronNorman
#3  29 January 2008 - 05:11
 
An ex fiance (1999 - 2001) was doing his dissertation in theology and it was because of our many conversations on God that I finally was lead to atheism. In the course of our discussions on God I managed to rationalize God out of my existence.

The only reason I might still cling to the idea of a higher being is because the concept of a beginning is impossible to imagine without being drawn into the discourse of infinity.

Infinity is a concept that boggles the human mind. How can there not be an absolute beginning? The only answer is that there is some explanation that goes beyond our capacity to comprehend.

I don't think about such things anymore because I am too busy dealing with my personal survival - making ends meet, making sure I stay sane, finding reasons to be happy, but it doesn't mean I don't find the entire discourse immensely interesting.

I think it is easier to believe in God, because it makes us feel safe, it adds order to our lives, we find solace in faith. I envy those who have faith in a higher being. When I am very sad and lost I have no one to pray to - I have to depend on myself. I do pray to my ancestors because I like to believe that we don't "just" end, but are echoes.
Contact me View user's mediablog RomaCittaEterna
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